Author Topic: What do I need to know to KS CK?  (Read 4319 times)

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Offline dimmu--borgir

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What do I need to know to KS CK?
« on: December 23, 2013, 07:50:16 AM »
Ok. Planning for a near future MAME KS for this game. Have read the threads here but I need some answers if anyone would be so humble..  ;) As fast and safe KS it is.

1. If any, what is the legimit version of this game? Seems to be a few different.
2. What about the barrel lvl skip? How it's done and is it acceptable?
3. From what I've read the pie factory is the only harder lvl compared to DK. What do I need to know here?

Well, thanks in advance!
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Offline pwnasaurus

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #1 on: December 23, 2013, 08:50:22 AM »
There can only be 3 pies (either 3 or 4 I forget) on the screen at one time.  The ones coming from the upper left get caught in the fire provided you don't go back down to the bottom area where they will get unstuck.  After 2 pies are trapped in the fire and one is harmlessly elsewhere on screen (or 3 are trapped), you can make the leap of faith to either final ladder.  Unless it's 4 not 3 that can be onscreen (I forget how many total) but that's the basic idea.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2013, 08:52:19 AM by pwnasaurus »
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Offline dimmu--borgir

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #2 on: December 23, 2013, 09:07:05 AM »
Thank you sir for that. That concludes Q:3.

The others please?
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Offline unkeptbeard

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #3 on: December 23, 2013, 11:17:15 AM »
I'm sure others disagree and I'm new to the scene, but the barrel skip should be accepted. It's not different than any other glitch. Everyone point presses the top of the rivets. It's the same thing. Actually if you are going for points the barrel skip would hurt your score. Lastly, the barrel screen is very easy, I'm probably the only one who dies on it regularly, the jump puts you at a bigger risk of losing a man. Just my two cents.
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Offline dimmu--borgir

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #4 on: December 23, 2013, 11:28:13 AM »
Care for an explanation how to do it?  ;)
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Online xelnia

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #5 on: December 23, 2013, 12:23:12 PM »
1. If any, what is the legimit version of this game? Seems to be a few different.


It depends on which version of MAME you are using. Anything BEFORE MAME 139 is called "Crazy Kong (set 1)" and uses the ckong.zip ROM set. In MAME 139 and newer it is called "Crazy Kong Part II (set 1)" and uses the ckongpt2.zip ROM set.

Quote
2. What about the barrel lvl skip? How it's done and is it acceptable?


The consensus around here seems to be that the barrel skip is acceptable, and I agree with that. It's actually a risky move and most useful to pass the 22-1 killscreen. The point-pressers will also use it if a fireball beats them to the top and it's unlikely they will be able to get past the fireball before the timer expires. Here's a YouTube video on how it's performed. You can ignore the what the guy says in the video. The key is to climb the first short ladder, position yourself a pixel or two the right, and then jump to the right off the girder. If your positioning is correct you will fall through the floor and "complete" the level. But play them all! They all have their own quirks and glitches that make them interesting.

Crazy Kong teleport trick level 1


Quote
3. From what I've read the pie factory is the only harder lvl compared to DK. What do I need to know here?


On level 2+ the pies come out very quickly. pwnasaurus' post is a good start to approaching that level. It is also possible to get to the retractable ladder on one side as soon as a pie enters the screen on the opposite side. The safest approach, however, is to wait until the 3 pies from the LEFT get stuck in the oil can.

Eventually, you might want to consider adding in the "hammer drop" on the pies as well.  ;)
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Offline ebinsugewa

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #6 on: December 24, 2013, 03:40:46 AM »
I keep seeing 'hammer drop' mentioned. What does this refer to?
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Online xelnia

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #7 on: December 24, 2013, 04:22:06 AM »
I keep seeing 'hammer drop' mentioned. What does this refer to?


Crazy Kong Glitches - Floor Skip, Hammer Drop, Elevator Island


The above video probably doesn't help much in describing the hammer drop, but it shows it in action. Basically, you have to grab the hammer and, while the lower platform is moving to right, run to the far right edge of the conveyor. When the Jumpman sprite collides with the wall, press right with the joystick/keyboard/whatever and the hammer will drop. Sometimes it drops in the "up" position, in which case you'll want to jump and retrieve it, then try to drop it again. The hammer sprite will eventually disappear but pies and fireballs will still be "smashed" if they run into that space.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2013, 04:30:13 AM by xelnia »
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Offline dimmu--borgir

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #8 on: December 24, 2013, 05:00:03 AM »
Fantastic glitches! Thanks for the answers. I will not try the jump lvl skip. Only succeed 2/10 times.

However. Anything I should know about wild barrels?

In the version I have (ckong set 1) it's not possible to go through Kong on the rivet lvl although I've seen otherwise somewhere. Is this version connected in som way?
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Online xelnia

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #9 on: December 24, 2013, 05:20:52 AM »
However. Anything I should know about wild barrels?

I believe the wild barrels behave the same as DK, but maybe more experienced Crazy Kongers could weigh in here.  ;D

Quote
In the version I have (ckong set 1) it's not possible to go through Kong on the rivet lvl although I've seen otherwise somewhere. Is this version connected in som way?

You are correct. In the "legitimate" version of Crazy Kong, its direct clones and Brazilian Kong, you CANNOT walk behind Kong on the rivet level. However, on the other Crazy Kong bootlegs, it is possible.

So, you can't walk behind Kong in the following versions:
Crazy Kong Part II (set 1) - ckongpt2 (MAME 139+)
Crazy Kong Part II (set 2) - ckongpt2a
Crazy Kong Part II (alternative levels) - ckongpt2b
Crazy Kong Part II (Japan) - ckongpt2j
Crazy Kong Part II (Jeutel) - ckongpt2jeu
Kong (Brazil) - kong

You CAN walk behind Kong in these versions:
Crazy Kong - ckong (MAME 139+)
Crazy Kong (Alca) - ckongalc
Crazy Kong (Galaxian) - ckongg
Crazy Kong (Galaxian, encrypted set 1) - ckonggx
Crazy Kong (Moon Cresta) - ckongmc
Crazy Kong (Orca) - ckongo
Crazy Kong (Scramble) - ckongs
Big Kong - bigkong
Donkey King - dking
Monkey Donkey - monkeyd

« Last Edit: December 24, 2013, 05:24:33 AM by xelnia »
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Offline dimmu--borgir

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #10 on: December 24, 2013, 06:16:13 AM »
Ok. Thanks. Did a lvl 10 run. Didn't have time for more. The wild barrels were quite abcent. Didn't count but somewhere between 5-10.

About your list. You write that you can go through with Crazy Kong - ckong (MAME 139+) which I also use. But I'm using a very old mame version, 0.80 or so. So it's really not version restricted it is also the MAME version?
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Online xelnia

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #11 on: December 24, 2013, 07:40:46 AM »
About your list. You write that you can go through with Crazy Kong - ckong (MAME 139+) which I also use. But I'm using a very old mame version, 0.80 or so. So it's really not version restricted it is also the MAME version?


The versions have changed names many times!  ;D

Simply:

The correct version of Crazy Kong is CURRENTLY called "Crazy Kong Part II (set 1)" and uses the ckongpt2.zip ROM set. In order to play this version of the game, here the names and ROM sets for OLDER versions of MAME:

Crazy Kong Part II (set 1)     
MAME Version    Game Name                        ROM set
0.027 - 0.033   Crazy Kong (alternate version)   ckonga
0.034 - 0.122   Crazy Kong (set 1)               ckong
0.123 - 0.138   Crazy Kong Part II (set 1)       ckong
0.139 - 0.152   Crazy Kong Part II (set 1)       ckongpt2


You should not be able to walk behind Kong on the rivet level on any version of MAME using the correct ROM set.

Also, here is what the attract mode looks like for the correct version of Crazy Kong. Be aware that this attract mode looks the same for Crazy Kong Part II (Japan) (ckongpt2j) and Crazy Kong Part II (set 2) (ckongpt2a).



Here's the attract mode for some other versions of Crazy Kong (ones in which you CAN walk behind Kong):

« Last Edit: December 24, 2013, 07:46:57 AM by xelnia »
"Do not criticize, question, suggest or opine anything about an upcoming CAG event, no matter how constructive or positive your intent may be. You will find nothing but pain and frustration, trust me. Just go, or don't go, and :-X either way!" -ChrisP, 3/29/15
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Offline dimmu--borgir

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #12 on: December 24, 2013, 10:32:59 AM »
Thanks Xelnia. You are the (C)ing of Kong.

Now I'm ready to KS!
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Offline _Zaphod_

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Re: What do I need to know to KS CK?
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2013, 03:06:16 PM »
Most levels have limitations forced by the hardware that make them considerably easier than on DK. except the rivets screen which has all 5 of it's fireballs.

The limit is 8 sprites+bigsprite. Mario is always one sprite, and one is reserved for the hammer when it's in use.  The bigsprite is Kong himself.  So only six sprites are available for enemies and moving platforms.  If another sprite would spawn but the hardware is at its limit, it is delayed until a sprite is freed up for it.  This is why the barrel tossing animation on girders screen will never line up.  Clearly the programmers didn't know how to multisprite (relocate a sprite in the middle of the raster beam so it can be rendered in two locations).   I think a better version of CK might be possible with multisprite, if the hardware is up to it.

Barrels is limited to four barrels and two fireballs.  also you can use the level skip trick, but it's risky, as failure means death.

Pie factory, there's a glitch that especially on level 2 and higher causes pies to get stuck in the fire, making the screen much easier. Pie limit is 3 or 4, and fireball limit is two or three (i forget what, but it adds up to no more than six)  The conveyor speed increase actually makes the level easier because of this.

Elevators is limited to 3 elevators, ONE fireball (the one on the right is missing), and two springs.  this takes out the challenge of lvl 5+.  The sprite limit delays what would be spring number three long enough to make a run for it regardless of length of spring 2 or "three".  Nete that no hammer exists in this level, BUT the hammer sprite is still reserved. The programmers could have done three springs.

But rivets screen has all 5 fireballs, and they have the flaming barrel hitbox instead of the firefox hitbox.  No hardware compromise needed to be made.  And all of the annoying randomness is present.  People also say the fireballs are more aggressive, and that it's actually harder then DK, but there's no hard data that I know of.

So most consider rivets the hardest in CK.  You get less barrels and fireballs on girders screen, many more free passes on the factory, and easy springs on elevators.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2013, 03:20:45 PM by _Zaphod_ »